Active [CAP] Special Attack Shut-Down [QC Approved 2/2]

[Blaguard]

Name: Special Attack Shut-Down

Description of Concept: A reliable poke that will check or counter most prominent special attackers in the tier.

Reasons for Concept: Among non-mega OU mons that have been suspected/banned in various metas, we have Aegislash (known for versatility, but often used as a special tank), Greninja (a mixed attacker that favored the special side), and Landorus-I (a near-exclusively special Sheer Force abuser). On top of that we have things like the Lati twins, Thundurus, Charizard-Y, Altaria, Gardevoir, Keldeo, Manectric, Serperior, Gengar, and more running around.

I'm not proposing something that could defeat all of them in every circumstance, but seeing as we have Intimidate and Will'o'Wisp to deal with physical offence, it would be nice to have something that could reliably check special attack and generally nerf it as a form of offence, be it from its typing, ability, movepool, or raw stat spread (keeping in mind new moves/abilities are not allowed of course).

 

[Matt_192]

Like I said in the main CAP thread, as long as we don't start creating custom abilities/moves at this stage, I think this is a good idea. Whilst we do have Chansey that checks most special attackers, we don't have very many strong, specially bulky attackers. Hoopa will partially fix this, but it doesn't have the greatest HP or recovery to warrant it being a full check.

 

[Martin]

I mean, we have a number of very solid checks and counters to special offense at the moment (namely prankster T-Wave Thundy, the blobs and Mega Sableye), but I could see this concept working. I mean, the most viable anti-meta thing that I can think of for special offense is definitely TR Reuniclus, which is capable of turning the effects of T-Wave in its favour most of the time, but generally speaking they act as good checks. I'm leaning towards approving this atm, but I'll need a little more convincing before a final verdict

 

[Blaguard]

Obviously the problem with the blobs is their Knock-Off weakness and lack of any momentum/offensive presence (unless we're including Clefable as a blob, which has far different problems but doesn't totally fill what I'm going for here). Thundurus is a great disruptor, but is still different than this concept, Hoopa might as well not exist at this point, and Mega Sableye is marvelous, but does take up the mega slot. Reuniclus is cool, but very niche and Psychic isn't a great defensive type in the age of Knock-Off.

Overall this thing won't be super revolutionary, but with a unique (or unique to OU) typing and solid movepool/ability (all pre-existing of course) it could provide a more unique option to deal with the special attackers that can pretty easily wreak havoc in the tier (seriously when have you been building a team and been like 'nah, Latios/Greninja/Landorus/Gengar would just be dead weight'?)

 

[Matt_192]

Whilst we aren't that far into the discussion, it's already clear to me that this is a perfectly valid idea - QC Approved 1/2

 

[Martin]

The main thing that is preventing me from approving this ATM is that special offense isn't really that hard to handle, and the only real way I can think of implementing this is either through adding another special tank or by implementing a new move/ability that functions like burn/intimidate for the special spectrum. I'm holding off on this for now until I get slightly more solid reasoning than "with a unique (or unique to OU) typing and solid movepool/ability (all pre-existing of course) it could provide a more unique option to deal with the special attackers" because it isn't exactly hard to fill a similar role with what exists.

 

[notsoclutch]

I think the real problem isn't necessary that special attacks are impossible to take atm, but that most if not all dangerous special attackers have ways past current special walls. I'm thinking that with the right typing and ability combo, we could help better balance out the current meta. I'd maybe like a tad bit more discussion for approval, but I'm definitely leaning approval at the moment.

 

[Blaguard]

I think the real problem isn't necessary that special attacks are impossible to take atm, but that most if not all dangerous special attackers have ways past current special walls. I'm thinking that with the right typing and ability combo, we could help better balance out the current meta. I'd maybe like a tad bit more discussion for approval, but I'm definitely leaning approval at the moment.

That's essentially what I'm going for, something that will be able to defeat common special wallbreakers (since that's all we seem to ban), not necessarily by being the fattest wall, but by having a better match-up and possibly a way to KO back. In the end I think it'll balance special attack as the no-downside form of offense that it's kind of become.

The main thing that is preventing me from approving this ATM is that special offense isn't really that hard to handle, and the only real way I can think of implementing this is either through adding another special tank or by implementing a new move/ability that functions like burn/intimidate for the special spectrum. I'm holding off on this for now until I get slightly more solid reasoning than "with a unique (or unique to OU) typing and solid movepool/ability (all pre-existing of course) it could provide a more unique option to deal with the special attackers" because it isn't exactly hard to fill a similar role with what exists.

Greninja and Landorus were banned/suspected because they're special attackers that are too hard to handle (I'm aware both ran physical moves on different sets, but they were primarily special sweepers) and the biggest argument is that they didn't have any switch-ins. Something that is different from what we have (since they kill SpD. Excadrill with STAB, Greninja can kill the Latis, and Chansey can't take them). If you can name something that can reliably switch into the majority of special attack (i.e. "filling a similar role with what exists") in the tier be my guest, but in my opinion it'll bring a lot of balance.

 

[Martin]

QC Approval 2/2
also fyi i was thinking ones outside of lando and gren 'cause they need to be banned anyway :]

 

[Blaguard]

QC Approval 2/2
also fyi i was thinking ones outside of lando and gren 'cause they need to be banned anyway :]

The fact that they're bannable is the reason for this idea ;]